View LISTSERV archives

CIO@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU


View:

:

[

|

Previous Message

|

Next Message

|

]

:

[

|

Previous Message

|

Next Message

|

]

:

[

|

Previous Message

|

Next Message

|

]

:

Proportional Font

LISTSERV Archives

LISTSERV Archives

CIO Home

CIO Home

CIO  July 2012

CIO July 2012

Subject:

Re: Are Coursera Courses Really MOOCs--and who cares?

From:

Anwar Karim <[log in to unmask]>

Reply-To:

The EDUCAUSE CIO Constituent Group Listserv <[log in to unmask]>

Date:

Wed, 25 Jul 2012 12:05:31 -0500

Content-Type:

text/plain

Parts/Attachments:

Parts/Attachments

text/plain (402 lines)

Patrick,

I will. How can I find couple of people like those for Banner DBA? :-)


Anwar Karim
Chief Information Officer
Office of the President
Texas A&M University - Commerce
Tel: (903)886-5421



-----Original Message-----
From: The EDUCAUSE CIO Constituent Group Listserv
[mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Masson, Patrick
Sent: Wednesday, July 25, 2012 11:58 AM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: [CIO] Are Coursera Courses Really MOOCs--and who cares?

I wonder...

I looked through HigherEdJobs (http://www.higheredjobs.com) to find an
open developer position (a general one, the first on the list), here is
the description:

--------------------------------------------------
JAVA WEB DEVELOPER.....to join a talented development team working with
a wide array of the latest web technologies through the full scope of
architecture, design, and implementation; and provide broad engagement
with the [campus name] community. Responsibilities include the
development and testing of major platform components and supporting
backend development of platforms/services across various [campus name]
systems.

REQUIREMENTS: at least four years of development experience with
complex, tiered, high-availability, Java-based Internet applications;
expert Java, Oracle/MySql design, and development skills; strong HTML,
CSS, and JavaScript/Jquery skills; broad experience with a range of
programming languages; strong background in web development and web
services utilizing J2EE technologies (XML/XSL/XPath/XML schemas, Struts,
Spring, Hibernate or other SQL database and Java object-relational DB
mapping, SVN, Bamboo, and Tomcat); experience with Ajax and XHTML; and
strong troubleshooting and debugging skills in a
distributed/multithreaded environment. Experience with Groovy/Grails
desirable. Must possess strong software implementation, problem solving,
technical, and communication skills. Familiarity with agile development
and object-oriented design a plus. Hands-on experience integrating with
SAP/R3 backend is preferred. Strong Tomcat or Apache skills helpful, as
is Perl experience. Must be able to multitask in a fast-moving
environment and possess excellent organizational, teamwork, and
communication skills. Should be comfortable working in a test-driven
environment with a diverse community of colleagues and customers.
--------------------------------------------------

So, in the light of all of the MOOC, OCW, OER, experiential learning,
badges, certificate, non-degree, etc. discussions, would you hire
someone for this position (or another similar), like:

- Oracle Java Discussion Forum User "sb92075?" sb92075, does not have a
university degree, but his reputation status, as defined by the 948,691
member community of the forum (peers), is "Guru." sb92075 has
contributed 29,039 posts to the forum (third most). He has been an
active member since Jun 27, 1999. The Oracle Java Forums enable
participants to gain a "reputation" (again sb92075 is a "guru").
According to the site, "It is possible for you to reward an answerer 5
points for a "helpful" answer or 10 points for a "correct" one (or none
at all). Users who accumulate certain amounts of points reach different
levels of recognition (see legend). In this manner, users who offer
consistently helpful or correct answers raise their standing in the
community."

-or-

Nathan XXXX
Mr. XXXX is the number one committer (772 commits) of the most watched
(3,687 watchers) Java project on GitHub (project name omitted). He has
also contributed to 40 other repositories. He is followed by 678 other
GitHub users and is currently following another 139 code repositories.
For argument's sake, he does not have a degree (he may, this is just an
example to pose a question).


I don't know if the attributes I have included, or the organizations I
have pulled them from, are the best, but GitHub and Oracle are both
recognized platforms with respected projects associated with them.
Indeed these two folks may have computer science PhD's (maybe their
development skills came through formal education and thus is why they
have such good reputations). What I am essentially asking is, would you
be willing to hire folks (like above) if a trusted peer community
recognized that individual as an expert, even if they did not have a
degree?

Just wondering,
Patrick


|| |||| |||     ||  | | || |||  || |||  ||  | | |||  || |||  ||
Patrick Masson
Chief Technology Officer, UMassOnline
The University of Massachusetts, Office of the President
333 South St., Suite 400, Shrewsbury, MA 01545

(774) 455-7615: Office
(774) 455-7620: Fax
(970) 4MASSON: GoogleVoice
UMOLPatMasson: AIM
massonpj: Skype

Web Site: http://www.umassonline.net
Blog: http://www.umassonlineblog.com
________________________________________
From: The EDUCAUSE CIO Constituent Group Listserv
[[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Ethan Benatan
[[log in to unmask]]
Sent: Wednesday, July 25, 2012 1:51 AM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: [CIO] Are Coursera Courses Really MOOCs?

This raises so many issues! I'll jump in on three.

Venture-capital backed free online courses may have stolen the moniker
"MOOC", but doesn't make them even slightly Open, let alone Massively
so. As a pragmatist I'm prepared to yield the name, but not the
principle.

First, I suggest that we all need to be more concerned about
openwashing, neatly defined by Audrey Watters as "having an appearance
of open-source and open-licensing for marketing purposes, while
continuing proprietary practices"; also see her related blog
post<http://hackeducation.com/2012/03/26/blackboard-moodlerooms-open-was
hing/>.

Second, we're not all MOOC investors/creators. I work at a small school.
We have modest means and a limited capacity to invest in MOOCs. We may
however see a big impact from them. We're starting to see credits and
credentials being connected to MOOC participation, a trend that
institutionalizes MOOCs as a cheap way of getting credit. I feel certain
that this trend will continue, and I am very interested in the
difference between a degree made up of a collection of MOOCs-the
ultimate swirl?-and something that we might have thought of, at some
former time, as a 'college experience'-whatever that is or was, and
however it was related to a degree. We support swirl; the vast majority
of our undergrads are completing degrees they started elsewhere. We're
not so sure about MOOCs. The point is that these free online courses are
just one more logical step in a direction we've been heading for a long
time, as higher ed stopped being primarily an immersion experience for
18-to-22-year-olds.

Third, many (perhaps most) of us have reason to be scared. As colleges
and universities we deliver a lot of services, but with few exceptions
what we charge for is the credit hour. The MOOC-like entities, whatever
they are, are effectively making credit hours free or nearly so. They do
this in a number of ways, including by not offering any of our other
services (those ones we don't charge for).  How does this not massively
undermine our business model, and what value is there in the other
things we do? This is a classic unbundling phenomenon (and a nice
example of "disruptive innovation", too). Depending on what you believe
about education (and your pay check), this may be a natural and positive
development in the marketplace, or a catastrophe of epic proportions. Or
both.

Ethan




--
Ethan Benatan, Ph.D.
Vice President for IT &
Chief Information Officer
503.699.6325

MARYLHURST UNIVERSITY
You. Unlimited.



On Tue, Jul 24, 2012 at 9:48 AM, Masson, Patrick
<[log in to unmask]<mailto:[log in to unmask]>> wrote:
Sharon - Great post and excellent question. I would be interested to
hear the rationale. Perhaps the folks on the Blended and Online Learning
CG
(http://www.educause.edu/discuss/teaching-and-learning/blended-and-onlin
e-learning-constituent-group) could offer a few reasons why as well?

Take care,
Patrick

|| |||| |||     ||  | | || |||  || |||  ||  | | |||  || |||  ||
Patrick Masson
Chief Technology Officer, UMassOnline
The University of Massachusetts, Office of the President
333 South St., Suite 400, Shrewsbury, MA 01545

(774) 455-7615<tel:%28774%29%20455-7615>: Office
(774) 455-7620<tel:%28774%29%20455-7620>: Fax
(970) 4MASSON: GoogleVoice
UMOLPatMasson: AIM
massonpj: Skype

Web Site: http://www.umassonline.net
Blog: http://www.umassonlineblog.com
________________________________________
From: The EDUCAUSE CIO Constituent Group Listserv
[[log in to unmask]<mailto:[log in to unmask]>] On Behalf
Of Sharon P. Pitt [[log in to unmask]<mailto:[log in to unmask]>]
Sent: Tuesday, July 24, 2012 11:46 AM
To: [log in to unmask]<mailto:[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: [CIO] Are Coursera Courses Really MOOCs?

Hi Josh,

You raise very important points.

I do believe that you are correct:  MOOCs were intended as a way to
openly share knowledge and work so that learners, wherever and however
those learners were defined, could participate in a common learning
experience.

I'm tempted to say that we have been doing this kind of work in in
higher education for years (e.g correspondence courses, TV broadcast of
produced courses), although new and emerging technologies certainly
allow greater capacity to mass, share and remix information.

And, yes, we should be concerned about the terms of service associated
with MOOCs, as with any technology or business service in which we
invest.

I would speak, as well, to purpose.  Why, as institutions, do we want
invest in the development of MOOCs?  Do we seek to expand access to
knowledge, via the "MOOC as Open Education Resource"?  Are we sharing
knowledge for the public good, in our responsibility to reach out to
learning communities?  Are we hoping to brand our institutions in areas
of excellence?  Are we seeking to market ourselves overseas, developing
international reputation?  Are we promoting our exceptional faculty?

The purpose of our investment in MOOCs help us to understand the terms
and conditions that we are willing to negotiate in the development of
such learning resources.

How about others?  Why is your institution investing in MOOCs?

All best,
Sharon

At 02:01 PM 7/20/2012, Josh Baron wrote:
I want to preference my question here with a couple of quick notes...

(a) Although I've been following the MOOC trend fairly closely and spent
time "observing" the MITx Circuits course, I'm still very much a
"learner" in this domain.

(b) Although I think there are possibly more questions than answers when
it comes to MOOCs, I find some of the things they are doing very
interesting/exciting and I'm also VERY happy to see higher education
experiment with new models.

My understanding (but those with more experience should certainly
correct me) is that the original concept of Massively Open Online
Courses (MOOCs) was really about creating learning communities that
would openly share knowledge and work as a community to create and
participate in a common learning experience.  Wikipedia notes (citing
several sources) that there are four core principles associated with
MOOCs, which are:

(1) The first principle is aggregation. The whole point of a MOOC is to
provide a starting point for a massive amount of content to be produced
in different places online, which is later aggregated as a newsletter or
a web page accessible to participants on a regular basis. This is in
contrast to traditional courses, where the content is prepared ahead of
time.
(2) The second principle is remixing, that is, associating materials
created within the course with each other and with materials elsewhere.
(3) The third principle is re-purposing of aggregated and remixed
materials to suit goals of each participant.
(4) The fourth principle is feeding forward, that is, sharing of
re-purposed ideas and content with other participants and the rest of
the world.

[more details and citations are at:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Massive_open_online_course]

When one considers these four principles they seem to center around, at
least for me, core concepts that closely align with things such as Open
Educational Resources and the other "flavors" of openness which have
been developing over the past decade or so.  For example, these
principles focus on things such as:  (a) content is produced as part of
the course, not prepared ahead of time; (b) content is remixed, both
within the course and with content outside the course;  and (c) content,
particularly remixed and re-purposed content, is shared among
participants and, importantly, with the rest of the world.

As I explored the Coursera site and considered signing up for a course I
decided to take a look (as I'm sure we all do ;-)) at the Terms of
Service ( https://www.coursera.org/about/terms) and was a little
surprised to see the following:

"All content or other materials available on the Sites, including but
not limited to code, images, text, layouts, arrangements, displays,
illustrations, audio and video clips, HTML files and other content are
the property of Coursera and/or its affiliates or licensors and are
protected by copyright, patent and/or other proprietary intellectual
property rights under the United States and foreign laws....You may not
otherwise copy, reproduce, retransmit, distribute, publish, commercially
exploit or otherwise transfer any material, nor may you modify or create
derivatives works of the material. The burden of determining that your
use of any information, software or any other content on the Site is
permissible rests with you."

In addition, they note the following related to user materials that are
submitted to courses:

"With respect to User Content you submit or otherwise make available in
connection with your use of the Site, and subject to the Privacy Policy,
you grant Coursera and the Participating Institutions a fully
transferable, worldwide, perpetual, royalty-free and non-exclusive
license to use, distribute, sublicense, reproduce, modify, adapt,
publicly perform and publicly display such User Content."

Now, I'm sure there are good legal reasons to have such statements but,
at least for me, they raised some big questions about whether some of
the really powerful learning that I've associated with MOOCs will come
out of Coursera courses if the ability to remix and share content is
limited (I'll also admit to being a little surprised that what I submit
seems, if I'm reading it correct, to be then owned by Coursera).   From
my participating in MOOCs I've found the contributions of students,
including content they develop, and how that content is remixed to be
integral to the learning experience.  If that is removed will the
learning experience be the same?   I've also felt that a powerful
outcome of MOOCs could be the establishment of a sustainable learning
community that would "survive" the course and continue to engage in
learning together...but I wonder if that would happen without the open
sharing and remixing of content?

Again, I am a big fan of change in higher education and I think Coursera
and other similar ventures are driving change in good and interesting
ways.  I'm also excited about the conversation that these ventures are
simulating.  I'm just wondering if what was originally a very open model
for learning is morphing into something that is more closed and what the
implications for such a shift might be with regards to learning.
Ultimately, I think there is a big question about whether initiatives
like Coursera are truly creating new powerful models for learning or if
we are simply creating "massive online courses" (dropping the open) and
from our experience with those in the late 1990's I'm not sure it will
result in the level of change we might all desire.

I'd love to hear other opinions and thoughts.

Josh
-----------------------------
Joshua Baron
Senior Academic Technology Officer
Marist College
Poughkeepsie, New York  12601
(845) 575-3623<tel:%28845%29%20575-3623> (work)
Twitter: JoshBaron ********** Participation and subscription information
for this EDUCAUSE Constituent Group discussion list can be found at
http://www.educause.edu/groups/.

Sharon P. Pitt
Executive Director
Division of Instructional Technology
George Mason University

416 Innovation Hall
MS 1F3
Fairfax, VA  22030
703.993.3178<tel:703.993.3178> (W)
703.993.4544<tel:703.993.4544> (F)
[log in to unmask]<mailto:[log in to unmask]>

http://doit.gmu.edu







<http://doit.gmu.edu/>********** Participation and subscription
information for this EDUCAUSE Constituent Group discussion list can be
found at http://www.educause.edu/groups/.

**********
Participation and subscription information for this EDUCAUSE Constituent
Group discussion list can be found at http://www.educause.edu/groups/.

********** Participation and subscription information for this EDUCAUSE
Constituent Group discussion list can be found at
http://www.educause.edu/groups/.

**********
Participation and subscription information for this EDUCAUSE Constituent
Group discussion list can be found at http://www.educause.edu/groups/.

************IMPORTANT - PLEASE NOTE ADDRESS FORMAT CHANGE****************

Our domain address is changing from tamu-commerce.edu to tamuc.edu.  Please be aware that anything sent to a faculty or staff email address ending in @TAMU-COMMERCE.EDU after September 2012, will NOT be received. EMAILS WILL BE REJECTED.  As we begin to transition our email system, please take proactive steps to ensure you have the correct email address. Our new email format for faculty and staff is [log in to unmask] Update your address books and contacts as soon as possible with the new email address format to mitigate potential issues in the near future. Thank you


**********
Participation and subscription information for this EDUCAUSE Constituent Group discussion list can be found at http://www.educause.edu/groups/.

Top of Message | Previous Page | Permalink


Options

Log In

Log In

Get Password

Get Password


Search Archives

Search Archives


Join or Leave CIO

Join or Leave CIO


Archives

March 2019
February 2019
January 2019
December 2018
November 2018
October 2018
September 2018
August 2018
July 2018
June 2018
May 2018
April 2018
March 2018
February 2018
January 2018
December 2017
November 2017
October 2017
September 2017
August 2017
July 2017
June 2017
May 2017
April 2017
March 2017
February 2017
January 2017
December 2016
November 2016
October 2016
September 2016
August 2016
July 2016
June 2016
May 2016
April 2016
March 2016
February 2016
January 2016
December 2015
November 2015
October 2015
September 2015
August 2015
July 2015
June 2015
May 2015
April 2015
March 2015
February 2015
January 2015
December 2014
November 2014
October 2014
September 2014
August 2014
July 2014
June 2014
May 2014
April 2014
March 2014
February 2014
January 2014
December 2013
November 2013
October 2013
September 2013
August 2013
July 2013
June 2013
May 2013
April 2013
March 2013
February 2013
January 2013
December 2012
November 2012
October 2012
September 2012
August 2012
July 2012
June 2012
May 2012
April 2012
March 2012
February 2012
January 2012
December 2011
November 2011
October 2011
September 2011
August 2011
July 2011
June 2011
May 2011
April 2011
March 2011
February 2011
January 2011
December 2010
November 2010
October 2010
September 2010
August 2010
July 2010
June 2010
May 2010
April 2010
March 2010
February 2010
January 2010
December 2009
November 2009
October 2009
September 2009
August 2009
July 2009
June 2009
May 2009
April 2009
March 2009
February 2009
January 2009
December 2008
November 2008
October 2008
September 2008
August 2008
July 2008
June 2008
May 2008
April 2008
March 2008
February 2008
January 2008
December 2007
November 2007
October 2007
September 2007
August 2007
July 2007
June 2007
May 2007
April 2007
March 2007
February 2007
January 2007
December 2006
November 2006
October 2006
September 2006
August 2006
July 2006
June 2006
May 2006
April 2006
March 2006
February 2006
January 2006
December 2005
November 2005
October 2005
September 2005
August 2005
July 2005
June 2005
May 2005
April 2005
March 2005
February 2005
January 2005
December 2004
November 2004
October 2004
September 2004
August 2004
July 2004
June 2004
May 2004
April 2004
March 2004
February 2004
January 2004
December 2003
November 2003
October 2003
September 2003
August 2003
July 2003
June 2003
May 2003
April 2003
March 2003
February 2003
January 2003
December 2002
November 2002
October 2002
September 2002
August 2002
July 2002
June 2002
May 2002
April 2002
March 2002
February 2002
January 2002
December 2001
November 2001
October 2001
September 2001
August 2001
July 2001
June 2001
May 2001
April 2001
March 2001
February 2001
January 2001
December 2000
November 2000
October 2000
September 2000
August 2000
July 2000
June 2000
May 2000
April 2000
March 2000
February 2000
January 2000
December 1999
November 1999
October 1999
September 1999
August 1999
July 1999
June 1999
May 1999
April 1999
March 1999
February 1999
January 1999
December 1998
November 1998
October 1998
September 1998
August 1998

ATOM RSS1 RSS2